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Author Topic:   Legacy LEDless Dredge
Heresy19
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posted June 14, 2011 04:22 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
Alright our meta has yet again changed at the LGS :/ So now it's Team America, Mill (lol), NO Plant (I know -_-), random white weenie with T2 cards (again, I know -_-), a somewhat good Pox deck, the rest is really random pile of nothing mixed together.

The Deck:

Creatures: 30

4x Golgari Grave-Troll
4x Narcomoeba
4x Putrid Imp
4x Stinkweed Imp
4x Tireless Tribe
3x Ichorid
3x Golgari Thug
2x Phantasmagorian
1x Flame-Kin Zealot
1x Sphinx of Lost Truths

Other Spells: 18

4x Bridge from Below
4x Breakthrough
4x Careful Study
4x Cabal Therapy
2x Dread Return

Lands: 12

4x City of Brass
4x Gemstone Mine
4x Cephalid Coliseum

Sideboard: 15

4x Leyline of Sanctity
4x Firestorm
4x Nature's Claim
1x Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1x Terastodon
1x Iona, Shield of Emeria

Is it pretty much optimal or is there something missing/needed to be replaced?

Thanks!

[Edited 2 times, lastly by Heresy19 on June 28, 2011]

 
Goaswerfraiejen
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posted June 14, 2011 04:57 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Goaswerfraiejen Click Here to Email Goaswerfraiejen Send a private message to Goaswerfraiejen Click to send Goaswerfraiejen an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Looks good to me. My one question, really, is whether you feel that Sphinx of Lost Truths is a better use of that slot than Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

Legacy UGB River Rock primer. PM comments/questions.
Info on grad school in Phil.



[Edited 2 times, lastly by Goaswerfraiejen on June 14, 2011]

 
Heresy19
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posted June 14, 2011 05:01 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur won't help me win the turn it comes into play, Sphinx does (majority of my games). Otherwise I would def replace the Sphinx for the Jin
 
Goaswerfraiejen
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posted June 14, 2011 05:22 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Goaswerfraiejen Click Here to Email Goaswerfraiejen Send a private message to Goaswerfraiejen Click to send Goaswerfraiejen an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Heresy19:
Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur won't help me win the turn it comes into play, Sphinx does (majority of my games). Otherwise I would def replace the Sphinx for the Jin


Oh yeah, fair enough. Brain fart, sorry. Looks pretty optimal for LEDless, then.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

Legacy UGB River Rock primer. PM comments/questions.
Info on grad school in Phil.

 
Myy
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posted June 14, 2011 06:05 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Myy Click Here to Email Myy Send a private message to Myy Click to send Myy an Instant MessageVisit Myy's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Myy's Have/Want ListView Myy's Have/Want List
I've always wondered why more people don't play Phantasmagorian.

I play it in my build and always find it useful. specially before a breakthrough.

 
Heresy19
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posted June 14, 2011 06:20 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by Myy:
I've always wondered why more people don't play Phantasmagorian.

I play it in my build and always find it useful. specially before a breakthrough.


I just saw a list running 3 of them online and thought ''OMS! Genius!'' lol :P

 
psilence6k
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posted June 15, 2011 07:07 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for psilence6k Click Here to Email psilence6k Send a private message to psilence6k Click to send psilence6k an Instant MessageVisit psilence6k's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I just also wanted to say that Phantasmagorian ROCKS!! I had to look up what he did when I saw it in your list and I liked it .

Cheers, Carl

EDIT: And it's name is sssoooooo cool!! Sounds like an 80's horror movie! Hahaha

[Edited 1 times, lastly by psilence6k on June 15, 2011]

 
Myy
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posted June 15, 2011 07:41 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Myy Click Here to Email Myy Send a private message to Myy Click to send Myy an Instant MessageVisit Myy's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Myy's Have/Want ListView Myy's Have/Want List
I first discovered Phantasmagorian when dredge barely came out and was made into a legacy deck, and the combo was sutured ghoul with dragon breath and fatties in the yard. It wasn't difficult to attack with a 30/30 hasty critter on turn 3.
 
Tranderas
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posted June 15, 2011 01:39 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Tranderas Click Here to Email Tranderas Click to send Tranderas an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Tranderas's Trade Auction or SaleView Tranderas's Trade Auction or Sale
We run Hapless Researcher in our LEDless dredge. The important things to consider about him vs Sphinx are:

* He can actually be cast by the deck at a lowly cost of U.
* When you use his ability, he replaces himself if you have even one Bridge in the yard.
* He enables you to continue comboing out t3 if you didn't get a lot of dredgers t1.

I don't really see the reason for Phant. I would cut the two plus sphinx for 3 hapless.

 
Heresy19
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posted June 15, 2011 06:33 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
Hapless are good but I never tested them. I'll give it a try
 
Heresy19
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posted June 25, 2011 09:56 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
Wich version is better? I think the LED one is faster but can be disrupted easily compared to the LEDless.

Thoughts?

 
Tranderas
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posted June 26, 2011 07:19 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Tranderas Click Here to Email Tranderas Click to send Tranderas an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Tranderas's Trade Auction or SaleView Tranderas's Trade Auction or Sale
Yeah, basically. You're talking about the trade-offs of running LED vs LEDless. Also, I feel the LED list is less consistent, relying on having an LED to be good. If it doesn't open on one it has a hard time getting rid of its hand compared to the LEDless version, which generally runs 8-12 hand-pitching cards (it will often run 4 tireless tribe, 4 putrid imp, and 3-4 breakthrough; i think the imps and BTs are enough, maybe not so much now that misstep is popular).

I mean, I think LEDless is better because I value those characteristics, but it's purely a judgment call IMO.

 
Heresy19
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posted June 26, 2011 07:47 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
But Tireless Tribe VS LED? TT can sustain aggro for a turn or 2, but LED can make me kill on turn one or two. Darn it :/
 
Shadows
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posted June 26, 2011 09:11 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Shadows Click Here to Email Shadows Send a private message to Shadows Click to send Shadows an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Personally, I run the LEDless version. As stated above, it's a lot more consistent. Though, having tried LED version, it's stupid amazing if you have LED in your hand.

No, this post probably doesn't help, but just figured I'd toss my opinion in. I personally love dread and have been playing it for a long time : ).

IMO LEDless > LED.

 
simbayu
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posted June 28, 2011 01:59 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for simbayu Send a private message to simbayu Click to send simbayu an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I prefer LEDless with tireless tribe. Dredge is already high variance. the LED version make it even more high variance. I prefer the better stability of tireless tribes.

Also, perhaps gitaxian probe over wraiths? Better synergy with cabal therapy although you lose ichorid synergy.

How are the Phantasmagorian's working out? Looks like a good idea.

 
Heresy19
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posted June 28, 2011 04:57 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by simbayu:

How are the Phantasmagorian's working out? Looks like a good idea.

They're AWESOME ! Instant speed discard and can be activated more than once before going back in my hands (3, 6, 9 cards can be discarted before the ability resolves )

 
Heresy19
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posted June 28, 2011 04:58 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
Alright you guys, I do prefer constency too so LEDless it it then
 
Goaswerfraiejen
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posted June 28, 2011 03:22 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Goaswerfraiejen Click Here to Email Goaswerfraiejen Send a private message to Goaswerfraiejen Click to send Goaswerfraiejen an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I was just thinking... how has Nature's Claim been working for you? Have you found yourself wishing for a combination of Ray of Revelation/Ancient Grudge instead? I mean, you might not want to dredge against some of the cards they'd hit, but you couldn't dredge Nature's Claim anyway, so you can just wait to draw them. But against other targets, it's a lot easier to dredge into them than to try to draw into Nature's Claim.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

Legacy UGB River Rock primer. PM comments/questions.
Info on grad school in Phil.

 
Heresy19
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posted June 28, 2011 04:05 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
NC are good but only as a 4 of. I want 1 of them in my starting hand if I have a grave hater. I could try 2/2 of rays and grudges and see what's best for my meta

I also LOVE a single Serenity with Sun Titan.... but then again, those would be better in a LED list (I think) :/

 
Shadows
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posted July 07, 2011 07:25 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Shadows Click Here to Email Shadows Send a private message to Shadows Click to send Shadows an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
So, I tried out Sphinx of Lost Truths in my build, and... wow, just wow. IMO it def deserves a spot in this deck.

Random bump but man, it's worth mentioning.

 
Heresy19
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posted July 07, 2011 08:45 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Heresy19 Click Here to Email Heresy19 Send a private message to Heresy19 Click to send Heresy19 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Heresy19's Have/Want ListView Heresy19's Have/Want List
Thanks mate

People underestimate the sphinx. It can won you the game as soon as it comes in the game. Sun Titan is a bomb in LED Dredge but this is LEDless

Thanks for the update tho

 

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