With SOPA affecting the way gianst like Google, yahoo, and sites like craigslist, ebay work. Will this affect MOTL in any way?

I've seen videos and such on youtube stating how we will be monitored, and even fined if we send an item with copyright on it. stating the collateral damage from this legislation would be enormous.

What are your thoughts? anyone know this topic in a deeper manner? do you belive it's a good thing or a bad one, what can we do so help? discuss!

~Myy

Just seems like it gives the owners of any sort of intellectual property a means to go after the people who steal it, and thus provide consequences for taking it. Not seeing the problem with it.

Seems like you'll just have to watch your video from the official source (since the owners of content would be idiots not to put it somewhere), instead of a bazillion other places. As a user on the internet, you lose out on some free stuff, downloads and such, or you risk actual consequences. Those are things you got used to having though, not things you should have.

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Originally posted by hilikuS:
That's sorta what I got out of it too, but I still fail to see where it takes away your freedom of speech, or anything like it. A lot of people seem to think that, and it just seems incorrect. Or maybe my perception of "free speech" is different from theirs.

Just seems like it gives the owners of any sort of intellectual property a means to go after the people who steal it, and thus provide consequences for taking it. Not seeing the problem with it.

Seems like you'll just have to watch your video from the official source (since the owners of content would be idiots not to put it somewhere), instead of a bazillion other places. As a user on the internet, you lose out on some free stuff, downloads and such, or you risk actual consequences. Those are things you got used to having though, not things you should have.

I guess I just don't understand the issue with it.

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Part of (well, the other half of the big gap which allows for abuse) the problem is that there's no due process for websites who have been accused - they get shut down as soon as a case is brought against them. No matter how you try to frame it, piracy is theft, and (this is venturing into personal opinion now) illegally downloading a CD is basically ****ing in the face of the artist who worked their ass off to create it. It's incredibly disrespectful, childish, and above all illegal. I purchase the content I enjoy whenever I can, to support the people who created it. I think everyone agrees piracy is wrong, and that something needs to be done. But this bill is unacceptable. It's not the intentions of the bill, but rather its ramifications that are cause for concern.

EDIT: as for people throwing around words like "firewall", "breaking the internet", and "infringing on free speech", well, there are uninformed people making uninformed statements about everything under the sun ever. Take it with a grain of salt. Would this bill suddenly turn us into china, as far as internet browsing is concerned? Probably not. But it's so poorly worded and the loopholes are such that it can a) be exploited for underhanded purposes to an undesirable degree, and that b) such exploitation can set precedent for future bills to expand upon it further.

SOPA is bad, very bad.

As a producer of games and other original content, I hate piracy. But, SOPA is not the answer.

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Originally posted by Bugger:
Part of (well, the other half of the big gap which allows for abuse) the problem is that there's no due process for websites who have been accused - they get shut down as soon as a case is brought against them. No matter how you try to frame it, piracy is theft, and (this is venturing into personal opinion now) illegally downloading a CD is basically ****ing in the face of the artist who worked their ass off to create it. It's incredibly disrespectful, childish, and above all illegal. I purchase the content I enjoy whenever I can, to support the people who created it. I think everyone agrees piracy is wrong, and that something needs to be done. But this bill is unacceptable. It's not the intentions of the bill, but rather its ramifications that are cause for concern.

EDIT: as for people throwing around words like "firewall", "breaking the internet", and "infringing on free speech", well, there are uninformed people making uninformed statements about everything under the sun ever. Take it with a grain of salt. Would this bill suddenly turn us into china, as far as internet browsing is concerned? Probably not. But it's so poorly worded and the loopholes are such that it can a) be exploited for underhanded purposes to an undesirable degree, and that b) such exploitation can set precedent for future bills to expand upon it further.

Edit 2: this explains it more eloquently than I can

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If what you're saying is the truth (and don't get me wrong, I tend to believe you), then I would be against the thing, but I'm also ok with them cracking down on piracy. Yeah I steal stuff, knowing full well it's illegal, but at the same time, how am I going to say "OMG how can you take that away from me?".

From what I did read of the bill, I found some crap about terrorism, and shutting down such sites as well. So I'm assuming the "without due process" stuff is trying to extend the Patriot Act?

It definitely disturbs me anytime they decide to not give someone a trial for their crime (which they may or may not have committed).

There was some other stuff about importing illegal material as well, which I'm assuming refers to bootlegging. Reading that thing was like getting hit by a board every 10 seconds the way it was worded.

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Originally posted by Bugger:
EDIT: as for people throwing around words like "firewall", "breaking the internet", and "infringing on free speech", well, there are uninformed people making uninformed statements about everything under the sun ever. Take it with a grain of salt. Would this bill suddenly turn us into china, as far as internet browsing is concerned? Probably not. But it's so poorly worded and the loopholes are such that it can a) be exploited for underhanded purposes to an undesirable degree, and that b) such exploitation can set precedent for future bills to expand upon it further.

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1: The scope of the legislation is too broad. It allows one careless user's actions to legitimate the takedown of an entire website. Note that this would be a very serious problem for any place where users have any sort of input. Also note that most news sites (including papers themselves) would be SOOL, since they recycle content from other sites, often word-for-word and without any attribution or compensation. If scope problems aren't addressed explicitly, we should all post a line of copyrighted text on corporate and government websites, forcing them all to get shut down indefinitely.

2: The definition of 'domestic' IP addresses is problematic, because it's any address allocated from the US. Since the Internet Number Registry is in the US, that means this American legislation will affect sites located in other countries, including Canada. Since we are not Americans and are not politically represented down south, that's a serious legal problem.

3: It criminalizes software and other tools with legitimate applications, such as hiding one's geographical location.

4: It allows the government to force independent companies to stop doing business with sites it deems inappropriate.

5 As you've all said, there's a serious lack of due process.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

also, it won't stop you from being able to access illegal downloading sites, just by typing in the IP address instead of the URL.

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Originally posted by Bugger:
Part of (well, the other half of the big gap which allows for abuse) the problem is that there's no due process for websites who have been accused - they get shut down as soon as a case is brought against them.

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I keep hearing this as the main case against SOPA/PIPA, but reading the bill, this simply is not the case. The site must be notified and given a chance to either take down the offending data or give a counter notice that explains why they are not doing anything wrong. Only after they either ignore the notice, respond saying that they will take it down and don't, or claim that they are doing nothing wrong can the complainant file with the court to get an injunction, and if the court sides with them, THEN things will get set into motion.

__________________
There's no need to fear, UNDERDOG is here!

All your Gruul Nodorogs are belong to me. Trade them to me, please!

Report rules violations.

This is interesting, seems things are getting heated a little...

Also under SOPA, WoTC could shut down both Salvation and MagicTrader, along with any other site they don't like.

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Originally posted by Lord Crovax:
http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2012/01/19/anonymou s-hackers-claim-to-take-down-justice-department-website-in-retaliation/

This is interesting, seems things are getting heated a little...

Also under SOPA, WoTC could shut down both Salvation and MagicTrader, along with any other site they don't like.

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Originally posted by Lord Crovax:
http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2012/01/19/anonymou s-hackers-claim-to-take-down-justice-department-website-in-retaliation/

This is interesting, seems things are getting heated a little...

Also under SOPA, WoTC could shut down both Salvation and MagicTrader, along with any other site they don't like.

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It's this kind of childish, stupid, and ineffectual reaction ("they're treating us like animals, so let's **** on the floor! now theyll respect us!") that almost makes me want SOPA to pass so we can be free of 4chan forever.

Any damn fool can DDoS a public website over a bag of cheetos and a half-liter of mountain dew. Talk to me when Anonymous does something that actually matters.

Frankly, I'm disgusted by their immaturity. Yeah, how DARE the government shut down a blatantly illegal website engaging in lawbreaking activity!

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Originally posted by Bugger:
It's this kind of childish, stupid, and ineffectual reaction ("they're treating us like animals, so let's **** on the floor! now theyll respect us!") that almost makes me want SOPA to pass so we can be free of 4chan forever.

Any damn fool can DDoS a public website over a bag of cheetos and a half-liter of mountain dew. Talk to me when Anonymous does something that actually matters.

Frankly, I'm disgusted by their immaturity. Yeah, how DARE the government shut down a blatantly illegal website engaging in lawbreaking activity!

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In fareness from what I've read SOPA/PIPA are no longer...so what they did, seems to have worked, at least for the moment...

I while I agree, childish yes, sometimes that's what one needs, think of it as a wake up call.

I also think the wake call came in for those who supported it more then the action itself.

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Originally posted by Bugger:
Any damn fool can DDoS a public website over a bag of cheetos and a half-liter of mountain dew. Talk to me when Anonymous does something that actually matters.

Frankly, I'm disgusted by their immaturity. Yeah, how DARE the government shut down a blatantly illegal website engaging in lawbreaking activity!

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Originally posted by Lord Crovax:
In fareness from what I've read SOPA/PIPA are no longer...so what they did, seems to have worked, at least for the moment...

I while I agree, childish yes, sometimes that's what one needs, think of it as a wake up call.

I also think the wake call came in for those who supported it more then the action itself.

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Here's the thing: anonymous, acting intentionally, managed to take down the Justice Departments website for a few hours.
Wikipedia, etc going dark, and google raising awareness about SOPA inadvertently crashed [I]dozens[/] of senators and representatives' websites for most of the day. It also inundated congresspeople's phone lines and inboxes with attention. It's not hard to think of which of the two had more of an impact in the halls of congress.

The reason Anonymous's little ****fit irritates me so is the same reason it frustrates me when I see crude and obscene emblems in Black Ops: thanks to a bunch of childish twits, a cause I care about ends up looking illegitimate or childish by comparison. To make a better analogy, Anonymous is to SOPA protests as PETA is to animal rights - theyre groups that, with their unreasonable antics, make everyone else look bad by comparison. Millions of people engaged in protest on wednesday, people who care about keeping the Internet free, and don't need new regulation to keep us behaving well...and then Anonymous goes and pulls a moronic stunt like this.

Stupid crap like this makes it that much easier for politicians trying to pass SOPA and laws like it to delegitimize the opposition. And that's not okay.

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Originally posted by hilikuS:
That's sorta what I got out of it too, but I still fail to see where it takes away your freedom of speech, or anything like it. A lot of people seem to think that, and it just seems incorrect. Or maybe my perception of "free speech" is different from theirs.

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Originally posted by HandicapParking:
Privacy and Freedom of Speech OP. Congress plz nerf.

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